Stereo Tool :: Stereo Tool 7.73

One could use 27, 1500 and 24000 Hz instead, but this makes the bands highly asymmetric, causing changes in sound and band flatness..

Hans, many AM processors had a phase positioning circuit that would favor whichever way the input audio was dominant. Voices and trumpets tend to peak more, one way or the other, and the processor would take advantage of that by rotating the phase to make the dominant side more positive. One advantage of this was that less clipping was required to keep positive levels high.

Is this something you could incorporate into the AM side of the processor without having to go through major gymnastics?

Thanks.

Jack

However the asymmetry comes from the fact that the outer bands intersect at a different frequency than the maximum of the midband.

Additionally your settings decrease the midband output level, so you didn't improve flatness either. (Yes, one could compensate for that, but that's not the point.)

Hans, many AM processors had a phase positioning circuit that would favor whichever way the input audio was dominant.

How did they switch without causing some plop or other bad artifact? I read that some early AM processors did this but they had a big plop in the audio when switching.

Author:	JesseG [ Wed Nov 04, 2015 10:34 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Stereo Tool 7.73
Quote: One could use 27, 1500 and 24000 Hz instead, but this makes the bands highly asymmetric, causing changes in sound and band flatness.. It seems to work OK for me with those frequencies.

Author:	\_/ [ Thu Nov 05, 2015 11:14 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Stereo Tool 7.73
Thanks for that optical illusion, JesseG! Tricked me too, for a minute. With all slopes the same, the midband looks asymmetric. So you changed them to correct that. However the asymmetry comes from the fact that the outer bands intersect at a different frequency than the maximum of the midband. What you did only moved the asymmetry from the midband to the outer bands, which admittedly, looks more pleasing to the eye but doesn't solve the problem. Additionally your settings decrease the midband output level, so you didn't improve flatness either. (Yes, one could compensate for that, but that's not the point.) So in the end you just proved my point, although your nice graph seems fine at first glance.

Author:	Bojcha [ Fri Nov 06, 2015 5:53 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Stereo Tool 7.73
Probably on program start soundcard "clicks" and then gates hold that.

Author:	DJ-DOGGY [ Fri Nov 06, 2015 5:54 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Stereo Tool 7.73
No way, the input sound card is a virtual cable - no clicks or any sound from it. Also on the other MB this is not happened.

Author:	RodeoJack [ Fri Nov 06, 2015 10:28 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Stereo Tool 7.73
Hans, many AM processors had a phase positioning circuit that would favor whichever way the input audio was dominant. Voices and trumpets tend to peak more, one way or the other, and the processor would take advantage of that by rotating the phase to make the dominant side more positive. One advantage of this was that less clipping was required to keep positive levels high. Is this something you could incorporate into the AM side of the processor without having to go through major gymnastics? Thanks. Jack

Stereo Tool https://www.forums.stereotool.com/

Stereo Tool 7.73 https://www.forums.stereotool.com/viewtopic.php?t=6164	Page 22 of 24

Author:	hvz [ Fri Nov 06, 2015 11:53 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Stereo Tool 7.73
Quote: Hans, many AM processors had a phase positioning circuit that would favor whichever way the input audio was dominant. Voices and trumpets tend to peak more, one way or the other, and the processor would take advantage of that by rotating the phase to make the dominant side more positive. One advantage of this was that less clipping was required to keep positive levels high. Is this something you could incorporate into the AM side of the processor without having to go through major gymnastics? Thanks. Jack How did they switch without causing some plop or other bad artifact? I read that some early AM processors did this but they had a big plop in the audio when switching. Since in many cases asymmetry will always be in the same direction (at least for presenters etc.), it might make sense to add a manual invert checkbox, in case the peaks are in the wrong direction. But, if you use the phase rotator, this is hardly the case anymore.

Author:	hvz [ Sat Nov 07, 2015 12:18 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Stereo Tool 7.73
I'm going back to Bass In Your Face since it's really an in-your-face bass. "Warm Bass" doesn't cover it - it's also deep bass. "Bass Dominator" - There's already an audio processor called 'Dominator'. "Fat bass" - Just don't like how that sounds (like it's a cheap effect, and it's not!) "Tube amp bass" - I don't have a clue what that would sound like... "Natural Bass" - we already have Natural Dynamics, I don't want to keep using the same word everywhere. Although it's probably the best description of all. "True Bass" - just sent to me by Bojcha, I kinda like it As a side not to explain what's so special about this: - If I generate a square wave at 50 Hz, I get a sequency of harmonics at 50, 150, 250, 350, 450 etc. Hz. Then, if I completely remove the 50 Hz ground frequency, this algorithm will generate it! - If I generate a sine wave at 150 Hz, and then run this algorithm, it does NOT generate a tone at 50 Hz, in fact, it does (nearly) nothing. So, it basically generates bass that's supposed to be there. If anyone has a better idea based on this description, or wants to vote for any of the names, let me know! I'm planning to build the 7.80 release this weekend (since I'm in the US next week and there I probably won't have time to do anything).

Author:	JesseG [ Sat Nov 07, 2015 12:52 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Stereo Tool 7.73
Quote: However the asymmetry comes from the fact that the outer bands intersect at a different frequency than the maximum of the midband. No, they intersect exactly in the center of Band 2. Quote: Additionally your settings decrease the midband output level, so you didn't improve flatness either. (Yes, one could compensate for that, but that's not the point.) Actually, based on my calculations, the middle band is up to ~ 1.4dB too loud. Band 1 and 3 sum to -13.5dB in the band center / intersection. Therefore Band 2 should peak at ~ -2.06dB for those crossover settings to be flat, but it peaks at ~ -0.6dB. Of course this is only fully relevant if nothing dynamic is happening with the input and/or processing. I'm sure it sounds better the way Hans' crossover algorithms work.

Author:	JesseG [ Sat Nov 07, 2015 1:05 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Stereo Tool 7.73
Quote: Hans, many AM processors had a phase positioning circuit that would favor whichever way the input audio was dominant. Quote: How did they switch without causing some plop or other bad artifact? I read that some early AM processors did this but they had a big plop in the audio when switching. It would still have audible effects even if the switching was somehow made inaudible. This is partly because most types of speaker & headphone drivers respond differently to positive and negative voltage, but mostly because we can hear when the polarity of asymmetrical sound waves are reversed.

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